Is the proverb "it's not over until the fat lady sings" offensive? [closed]

The proverb "it's not/it ain't over until the fat lady sings" is generally understood to be referencing the stereotypically overweight sopranos of the opera (according to Wikipedia). I've got a feeling that the proverb is offensive to female opera singers because it seems to stress that they weigh too much. That's why I'd prefer "it's not over till it's over" to "it's not over until the fat lady sings."

But I may be wrong, and there is nothing wrong about the saying in question...

I wonder if the proverb is really not so neutral. Isn't "fat lady" disapproving, making the whole sentence sound, well, slightly offensive?


There are many sites that wonder about this in the same way, and news articles about 'PC run amok', and brouhaha over hypersensitivity:

‘It’s not over till the fat lady sings’: ABC says popular saying isn’t PC (Australian, 27 Jul 2018)

"It ain't over until the Fat Lady sings!" There are suggestions this saying is offensive and fat-shaming! (US, 25 Jul 2018)

Show really is over after the 'fat lady' quits (UK, 9 Jan 2010)

What this tells me is that there are some people who find 'fat lady' offensive (it's hard to tell how many, but certainly the literal opera singers, the object of the quip), and there are also some people who are upset that some other people find it offensive.

I gather from this that it is slightly offensive. Whether it should be considered offensive or not is a value judgement that is a bit argumentative. But if you use the phrase just be aware that even euphemisms ('portly', 'hefty', 'husky') might imply offensiveness.


Perhaps it is currently perceived as offensive by heavy female opera singers but as a slim male, with a mediocre voice at best, I cannot speak regarding their attitudes toward this idiom. I can, however, speak regarding the population as whole.

The origin of this phrase is:

'The phrase is generally understood to be referencing the stereotypically overweight sopranos of the opera. The imagery of Richard Wagner's opera cycle Der Ring des Nibelungen and its last part, Götterdämmerung, is typically the one used in depictions accompanying reference to the phrase. The "fat lady" is the valkyrie Brünnhilde, who is traditionally presented as a very buxom lady with horned helmet, spear and round shield (although Amalie Materna played Brünnhilde during Wagner's lifetime (1876) with a winged helmet). Her farewell scene lasts almost twenty minutes and leads directly to the finale of the whole Ring Cycle.1 As Götterdämmerung is about the end of the world (or at least the world of the Norse gods), in a very significant way "it is [all] over when the fat lady sings."

wikipedia.org

In that era obesity was celebrated and not looked down upon as it is currently. A most recent example is Lillian Russell, a famous heavy actress and singer, who was regarded as beautiful even in the early 20th century!

blog.sermo.com

Nowadays, most people don't even think of the origin when they use the idiom. They simply interpret it as 'don't count your chickens before they hatch,' or as you suggested, 'It's not over till it's over.'

Therefore I would suggest that most people would not find the idiom, or a sentence containing it, offensive.